767. - Justin Pearson

All right, this episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by Stateside with Kai and Carter, a new podcast from The Guardian. And they are using this podcast to slow down the news and wrestle with the questions that we all have about what's happening in the world. And they do it three times a week, Jason. Does that sound familiar to you? We don't really talk about, you know, a lot of international global news items and climates and cultures and sports and things like that. We do talk about fashion and wellness, but for everything else, Kai and Carter are a great place. All right, so who couldn't use more news? Listen wherever you get your podcast. or watch on YouTube. How long gone? How long gone? It's Chris Black coming to you live from my favorite recording studio, the J. Crew offices in downtown Manhattan. It's exciting. It's one of my favorite. I've got a view. You know, it's much better than my house or any other place I've been lately. How are you feeling, them jeans? The view is better than the view of anywhere you've been lately. You've been all over the world, bro. Come on. Yeah, but what's more beautiful than downtown Manhattan on a sunny day? It's tough. Okay. Is this going to be a working podcast, or are we going to be online? Well, I mean, I have to be online to use the Zoom application. So I'm not really sure what you're asking. I don't mean literally on the network. I don't mean 5G. I mean your mental 5G. My mental is good. Are you going to have one eye on your notes and one eye on the Gmail? No, no, no. Well, I always have one eye on the Gmail because if one of us doesn't, we could miss something. You know what I mean? That's true. I'd hate to miss anything. You love being first to market as it pertains to replying to an email. That's actually, yes, that's one of my defining characteristics. But I'm very happy to be back in New York. The weather's amazing. It's really prime time. Happy for you. Kind of early spring. Yeah, this is the time of year where the temperature in L.A. and the temperature in New York are the same. No, you're right. And I know that makes you very upset. It's fucking horse shit is what it is. Also, don't forget to walk over to Gene's and pick up my check, okay? Thanks, sweetheart. Yeah, they keep being like, I'm like, I know nightclub. No one's going to be there until 9 p.m.

That's true. I don't know how it's going to happen. It's like when you leave your coat there and they're like, cool, just come here at 11.45 p.m. on a Tuesday. I was like, can't you just mail it to me or wire the money like a normal human being? But no, I'll collect it this week. I've got some time. I'm here for at least a week, so I'll be able to go by and take care of business for you. I'm sorry for talking about this on the pod. I know our listeners don't want to hear about that. You know, light accounting. Let's see what else we got here. Yeah, I guess speaking of podcast accounting, I've been getting a lot of comments or messages from people who want to talk about the irony of ads that are playing on our podcast or another podcast. People will say like, oh, there's a boom, blah, blah, blah. I can't believe you played this ad right after you were talking about this, you know, sweet hypocrisy going on. And I just wanted to let our listeners know that there's two different kinds of ads on podcasts. There's programmatic and then there's like host read. So like when Chris and I are doing an ad read for BetterHelp and we're talking about it, that is a podcast ad that we agreed to do and are obviously doing it because you're listening to it. And then programmatic ones are where just a company inserts random ads. It could be for... you know, a car company or something or juicy brand cognac or whatever. And I just want to let people know that those ads are served to you through an algorithm that's based on the listener and not based on the podcast. So yes, you're basically if you if you think some an ad that is playing is bad or dumb or funny, it's your fault. It is. It is your fault. And it's not necessarily your fault, but it's more so based on. how old you are, what part of the world you live in, and what type of hole or pole you're into. It's cool because I haven't listened to this podcast in two years at least, maybe more. You've got to check it out. It's getting better.

I don't know, but I know that people are like, you guys had an ad for Tampa tourism. I'm like, yeah, dude, I don't give a shit. Once again, any feedback regarding advertising, you can please suck my dick from the back because we are giving you this for free. We've never charged you for this. Would you rather hear funny ads or pay $10 a month? It's up to you. You know what I mean? Yeah, so the call is coming from inside the house. I was listening to our guest today. He's a punk rock kind of legend in the game, and I was listening to an episode of a podcast where he was being interviewed. It was a show where punk rock people appear on it. The singer of a band called Fucked Up is the host, and I'm listening to this podcast in the car, and I get served an ad for the all-new Mercedes-Benz, an ad read. I'm in a Mercedes-Benz driving to Whole Foods. It's time to check out the all-new Mercedes-Benz. And you know damn well that has nothing to do with gutter punks in fucking Saskatoon. No, it doesn't. It's all me. It's because I'm such a fucking baller. Yeah, that's what it is. It's all you. It's all you. I don't listen to podcasts that I don't think I ever get. I don't think Joe Budden doesn't do programmatic, so I don't ever hear any. He doesn't do any. It's just prize picks. It must be nice. Actually, no, it's not nice. I love doing ads. Are you kidding me? That's like our actual passion. I think we like doing ads more than we like doing the podcast itself. We will call it advertorial is what we do, Chris. I wanted to tell you a quick sauna story that kind of left my blood boiling. um i was able to the i was staying at a hotel in london called the londoner that had a really nice pool and like steam room and sauna you know indoor obviously and original name too i went there at like you know like 1 p.m because you know new york was kind of just getting waking up so i was i had a little time and i was like you know what this is gonna be nice i'm gonna be peaceful i'm gonna go to the sauna alone

First of all, I'm in the sauna and my AirPod falls out and fits through the tiny crack and melts. The AirPod literally melted. You saw the pod melting. I saw the pod melting. Good name for a new network. I finally found it. Anyway, there's a pool. It's 1 p.m. on a Tuesday. About as off of a time as you could get. There was a guy who... was I think what we would refer to as a chav, where he had Versace boxer briefs as a bathing suit, Versace slides, and tatted up, you know, big, ugly, like, Breitling watch on. And he had a, how do I say this? Very, very, very voluptuous friend with him who was too large for her clothing. And her clothing was very minimal to begin with. So we're out of the... This is when we're in the actual gym. You did not bring his bird into the locker room, did he? No, I'm saying I'm in the sauna and they're by the pool and it's all connected. So it's unisex. It's unisex. It's just me and them. And I was down there for 45 minutes and these fat pieces of shit went through two bottles of champagne at 1 p.m. and were being... so loud and like yelling at the, like made up a nickname for the server. We're just berating him. It was like, it was all, I couldn't watch it, but then, but I was scared of them because they're so mean and her lips were so fake. And I was like, do I, but I had to walk by them like to get my stuff. You know what I mean? Like to collect my shirt and my, et cetera. And I was, I was really worried they were going to try to talk to me. I was really, I was like legitimately nervous because I'm like, this guy wants to fight for sure. He'll fight anybody. you know what i mean so i had to like really i kept my head down i was like i was walking by my bullies in high school you know what i mean because i didn't want i didn't want to interact with these drunk these drunk like essex right right right you know that would have been a very kind of eastern promises style fight where you you and a guy with his dick out are trying to stab each other in the neck with a broken bottle of moette

Dude, it was honestly something. I was like, first of all, what is the – and I asked some British friends what the equivalent – because it felt like something that would have happened at the right-wing Ritz-Carlton in Palm Desert. You know what I mean? It felt like that kind of thing, but they're like, no, it's the same. This guy's also a builder. This guy's also a contractor, just like the people. It's the same thing. I was like, okay, that makes sense because it felt a little more drug dealery, but those two things are kind of interchangeable, I guess. Did you have a comment or a witty retort in the chamber in case they engaged with you? I didn't allow myself to take it that far. I didn't allow myself. That's all I would have been. I would have worked out the entire. I would have. 50 pages of dialogue would have been worked out in my head in that song. I had so little interest in speaking words to them that even if barked at, I think I might have like scurried away. You know what I mean? I think, I think, I think that I might've been finally for once in my life at a loss for words because this guy would have absolutely knocked my teeth out. And his, and his chick, I mean, his chick was literally like, I mean, her titties could knock me out. You know what I mean? She was huge. Okay. So even if it was just, her and her like twink friend it still would have been a little bit a little bit touch and go obviously you'd be okay but like it would be more of a truck more more trouble than you were bargaining for it was more it was more trouble and i was looking i was looking to relax they were looking to turn up those two things were at odds and i have to say they beat me i left the sauna earlier than i would like to because i could hear them through the door i guess all you can do in those situations is just wait for karma to to get back to him well also i think that if i wouldn't have been there they would have been having intercourse in the pool oh i think that was also i think they were like trying to smoke me out with loud talking and obnoxious laughing to get me out of there so they could do their thing that's my guess yeah those those situations are the worst i've been in that when when you're at like a bar or something like that and it's just you and another

You and your cool friend who's kind of a pussy and then a table of like four guys with face tattoos. Jason, the story of our lives is being out with a friend who's kind of a pussy. That's literally our entire lives. And if you've never been in that situation, you are the pussy friend. Yeah, that's a defining characteristic of both of our lives. I've been both the friend and the pussy friend in this equation many times. A table of four, like you said, one o'clock on a Wednesday. I'm like, oh, I'm going to watch the Man United game because Dano wants to go and we're going to have a beer or whatever. And then these guys have been drinking there since 11 a.m. And the waitress, the server comes over and they're slapping her in the ass and berating her. And then one of the guys is looking at me just like. What are you going to do about it? You're like, not shit. And I look at the server. I'm just like, so sorry, lady. If anyone does anything, we're getting stabbed. And we just got to hope that the police come maybe or hope that a building falls on them tomorrow or their kids get taken away from whatever it may be. Best thing we can hope for. It's the checkmate. Sometimes you get checkmated. Sometimes you can get checkmated. Our guest today is a certified legend. He put San Diego on the map with The Locust. He was in the band Swing Kids, which if you're familiar with, is legendary. He was in Some Girls with Friend of the Show West from American Nightmare. The list goes on. He has a record label called 3-1-G that put out five-inch records. We're going to get into that. A lot of five inches in their catalog. A rare. A lot of blast beats on a 5-inch. Yeah, they've done a lot. They released a lot of kind of electronic music in the electro-clashy kind of space when I was first getting into, you know, dance music and things like that. I was probably doing more coke than he was. But, you know, he put out records for, like, Adults and Quintron and Cool, interesting, you know, Unbroken, of course. Cool Keith.

Antioch era. The list goes on. Black Dice, Blood Brothers, Camera Obscura, Cattle Decap. It's all there. Oh, not Cattle Decap. Is this the first time Cattle Decapitation has been mentioned on How Long Gone? Or do you think it's come up before? No, I brought it up. I bring it up quarterly. Okay, let's give them a call. Oh, this is huge for me personally. This episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by TaskRabbit. Oh, baby, let me tell you something. This is not a joke. I use TaskRabbit a lot. Because I can't do anything. You need some art hung? TaskRabbit. You need something put together? A cabinet? Got to reach that cheese grater on the top shelf? TaskRabbit. Anything you need, TaskRabbit can take care of it for you. How it works, TaskRabbit connects you with skilled taskers in your area. They can help you move. They can assemble furniture. repairs, yard work, mounting, and more. You can search for a Tasker based on cost, skill set, availability, and past client reviews so you know exactly who's showing up and can have confidence that they know what they're doing because Taskers have assembled over 3.4 million pieces of furniture, completed 700,000 home repairs, handled 1.5 million moves, and the numbers are just going up, Jason. Yeah, throw a little money at the problem. It's not so expensive, and that job that you really don't want to do is something that another person out in the world, is very good at doing and would gladly do it in exchange for a little bit of money. So... When life happens, your to-do list grows. Get ahead of it now and get $15 off your first task at TaskRabbit.com or grab the TaskRabbit app using promo code HOWLONG. Taskers book up faster, especially for same-day tasks. So book trusted home help today. That is $15 off your first task using promo code HOWLONG with the TaskRabbit app or at TaskRabbit.com. This episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by Squarespace. Obviously, Jason, you and I spend a lot of time on the World Wide Web. So do our peers, our listeners, our friends, our colleagues, maybe even your parents if they're freaky. And if you're doing anything in the world, writing, taking pictures. I do topless boxing. You need a website. Exactly. A website that works, that does what it's supposed to do, that allows you to be creative but also business-minded.

Jason, there's one place to go for that, Squarespace. Yeah, Chris, I'm over here. I'm modifying calculators and putting Claude inside of them so you could cheat at school. And I just want a place where I could, you know, have everything all in one place. I can have the SEO tools so those future graduates can find me. And, you know, I'm able to accept, quote, unquote, donations for my services that might be gray area. You know what I mean? And then email campaigns. Hey, I got a new 2.3 version upgrade. Boom, boom, boom. Get the analytics going. Raise some money. Show your investor all of your cool analytics of what's going on. They're going to want to get in early. And we can use Blueprint AI to make your website look as professional as your competition, if not more. So head to squarespace.com slash howlong for a free trial. When you're ready to launch, use offer code howlong to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or a domain. This episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by a new podcast from The Guardian stateside with Kai and Carter. This is covering a lot of our bases, Jason. It's trying to slow down. The news and wrestle with the questions we all have about what's happening in the world. And I know you particularly have quite a lot of questions. A lot of questions. But how often? Because we do this podcast three times a week and that's a sweet spot. How many times do they do? Three times a week. And I have a feeling just based on the platform and these talking points that they're maybe going to be covering different stuff than we do. That's just a guess. The Guardian is not some billionaire owned. They're not afraid to say what they want to say, brother. Yeah, Rupert ain't sniffing around in what journalists Kai Wright and Carter Sherman are up to over there at Stateside. But yeah, listen wherever you get your podcasts. You can watch it on YouTube. It's three times a week. And who couldn't use more news? Especially when it's not from here, let's say. Give it a listen. Give it a listen.

It's funny. I have a podcast and I insist on it always being in person, which is good because then I don't have to do a shitload of podcasts. We do the exact opposite. We do a shitload of podcasts because we do them remote. Literally, we do the exact opposite. Justin, you were saying that you saw The Exploited in San Diego last night. Can you give us a scene report, please? Well, okay. It's a little... uh loaded of a of a situation because they were uh i had wadi on on my podcast cult and culture so so um that was like okay i mean i grew up liking the exploited um oh god it's such a loaded question uh well let me just say this well if it makes you feel better justin the exploited is not listening to this podcast right now or that maybe some of their friends might be but it's highly unlikely well okay so God. Well, okay, I've always liked The Exploited. And I was recently on tour in Europe with my band Def Club, and we played with Unbroken, who were playing this festival. And on the billing, it was like, Unbroken, The Exploited. And I'm like, what the fuck? Like, that's crazy that you guys are bigger than The Exploited over there. And Rob Moran. Truly. Yeah. And Rob Moran is like, dude, they're so awesome. And I was like, they're good. I really do like their kind of like more. brashy metal stuff and um And so he was like, so anyhow, they played. We were on tour with, we played a few shows with Unbroken, but one of them we didn't play, which was that festival. So we like reconnected with Unbroken. And Rob was like, dude, they were so fucking sick. Like, you know, just like hyping them. And I was like, oh, that's crazy. I just figured like, why do you have five heart attacks? And like, they're just, you know, he, you know, like late. For listeners, for listeners who don't know, exploited, legendary kind of UK punk band from like late seventies. So there's, there's a lot of people listening who don't know who they are. want to do a little paint the picture for you that's crazy i feel like everyone should know like the beatles the exploited you know i feel like i feel like people would recognize the t-shirt and not know it was a band you know what i'm saying yeah yeah it's very misfits-esque it's got some great iconography grateful dead style you know great great iconography great iconography i would be so bummed if i was in a band like that that had a great logo and that's kind of it that's it yeah like black flag

You've been in the Locust, bro. You've been in the Locust. That is a good logo, but I don't know if we're up to that level at all. I mean, if I see the Locust logo with no words on a butt patch somewhere in Fountain Valley, I'm like, yeah, hell yeah. I know what that is. It's code. There's the crass logo and stuff, too. Yeah, you kind of win the logo lottery if you get to that. I feel like punk logos are... Yeah, I feel like the Grateful Dead is the biggest one, like the best example, like the most global example, but I feel like punk is the following genre that has the most. Like, Crass and Black Flag especially, like those are very recognizable. Those both are loaded. First, with the Dead, you have like... everybody putting the stickers on their car which they live in so you're like oh okay you know and with black flag those guys kind of fucked up because you got all these like nazi skinheads with bar tattoos on their neck and you're like oh we fucked up you know so uh yeah it was a different time back then there's a little more crossover in terms of the racism that was kind of like part of the issue with like or not the issue but like my concern with having wadi on our podcast i was like i don't know like they associate with nazis and blah blah blah but it was different and we actually talk about it on the episode so like um it was interesting because and then and for me like growing up in the late 80s early 90s punk and hardcore it was a fucking different landscape like every show you went to there were nazi skinheads there it was just part of the thing and it wasn't like yo you guys are fucking cool it was just like fuck they're here well we have to you know mosh or whatever you know maybe there's gonna be a fight maybe there could be a fight and there was But, yeah, he, like, pretty much, like, laid it out. And it was impressive. I'm going to say he is a rad guy. And, like, I really, really like him a lot. I like his band, his girlfriend, everyone that was with him. Like, they were all fucking cool. The audience, I was a little let down, to be honest. Because you wanted to listen to your report. So I was really let down because I, in my mind, had seen shit like that growing up. So, like, I wanted it to be, like, total fucking crazy. Yeah, yeah.

Bikes and Mohawks and stage diving and circle pitting. And it was, like, at one point, okay, DI opened, which I also like DI, but they were terrible. So there was, like, this really shitty, like, circle pit happening. And this fucking kid, he probably was, like, you know. Not that it was a bad thing that he was young, because I did that. But he was circle-pitting, and he fucking stops to tie his shoe. And everyone's like, whoa, let him tie his shoe. And I'm like, what the fuck? Dude, this is bad. And that's not a diss on the bands, necessarily. It's just like, who are you guys? Everyone's so fucking fragile. I was like, just kick his ass and mosh, or slam dance or whatever. Let him tie it. Stop, stop. He has to tie his shoe. A guy stopping a circle pit to tie his Doc Martens does feel like a very modern problem. That feels like a very modern problem. I mean, I can pick apart everything. all like his trouser patches were like fresh you're like dude you don't live in those man like what what's going on like you know like you probably got them dry cleaned or something you know i don't know it was like i always get i always get my crust pants dry cleaned as well it helps maintain the aging perfectly you know what i mean you want the patches not too much not too much not too much yeah dry cleaner hates to see him coming no not again you broke the machine last time i do have a dry cleaning story because at once one time when the locust was on tour we are toward the yes and like, this super regiment, like, just, like, crazy schedule, and our uniforms are fucked. Like, they smell so bad, and, like, we went, we were in London, and we had two days in London, so we're like, dude, we have to get these things clean. They're so gross, and the only... place to the to the only way we get to like dry clean them was a dry cleaner not like a laundry place and so we're just like bringing in these uniforms with masks and the lady's like what the fuck is all this and it like smelled and then she was just like what you know like on the on the form it's like trousers uh you know shirt whatever and then she's just like what is this you know holding up the mask and we're like it's a mask you know it's not sexual it's not sexual i promise and i'm supposed to resemble an insect what are you talking about lady yeah she

She was like, you guys are fucking weird and gross, but we'll take your business. Yeah, we're going to take your business. Yeah, I wonder, because at a certain level of touring, you have the wardrobe, you know, road cases and everything is kind of sequestered. You know, you go backstage at a Harry Styles show, all the sparkles have been cleaned and they're hanging in the, but when you're in the Locust, it's probably a little different is what you're saying. Much, much different. And it's funny because at one point we were like, oh, we need two uniforms so we can like. Clean them or alternate. Someone had stolen Gabe's shirt to one of them. We were like, we have to wear this other one. Otherwise, he's just got no shirt anymore. Whatever. Real problems. Should we start this podcast? We started a long time ago. You said that you've been in all these bands and there are a lot of underground legendary bands. They can be considered harmful to most people's ears and a lot of people enjoy it. At the peak, you said you were on tour with Yeah Yeah Yeahs. Was that your biggest tour? Not a solo tour, but who was the biggest band that you went out on a run with properly? I did this really fucking stupid thing where I went on tour with the Bloody Beat Roots. Okay, friends of the show, Bloody Beat Roots. okay well i mean i don't i don't care i don't care i mean like i i go back with aoki along we we used to i used to dj with all those guys back in the day so i have yeah i have a connection to him but we're not like friends or anything so shit talk away i do it every episode don't worry okay here we go so i'll say this like um i i was a dick to to bob uh bob refo the bloody beat roots guy and i and i i probably shouldn't have you know but i was like man this is crazy There's a lot to that. So I wrote a book about it, actually, which probably didn't help. He's probably just like, I'm going to fucking sue this guy or kill him or whatever. I don't think he'd kill me. I don't think he's badass enough or even try to fight me. But he pulled some bullshit with me. They wanted to hire me to go sing on tour with the Bloody Beer Roots. And I was like, well, sure. Yeah, I want to go to Australia. That sounds fucking rad. And they're like, we'll pay you $1,400 for two weeks. And I was like, that sounds cool.

so so i agreed to it they're like okay well we need you to like uh they didn't they didn't say like this is the material you know so in my mind i'm thinking i'm gonna sing the like whoop whoop song and then i'm gonna sing they were doing this all leather remix of a band that i was in there i was like okay i'm gonna sing those two songs i i got that i know my own song and i know whoop whoop so so they're like You're working seven minutes a day. This sounds pretty easy. Totally. They're like, we need you to be the hype man. I'm like, I have no fucking idea what that is, but I'm totally going to go because Australia is rad and I want to go do something fun and get paid $1,400. I kept saying, what songs or what material do I need to know? They're like, bro, you need to have Converse, torn up pants. you know clash t-shirts and i'm like what like what songs do i need to learn i mean i don't have any of that shit like my pants i'm fucking desperately trying to not let them get torn up i and i at the time i only wore vans you know and i was like i was like i got i don't have any like punk shirts i was like i have a carcass shirt and then i just have a bunch of shit like that doesn't say like i don't know what the casualties or whatever you know and i was like maybe i'm not the right guy to uh and then drive like jehu hoodie extra medium how's that gonna work he's just like what's that you know uh but um so so yeah i went on tour with them it's like fucking crazy because um we were like in fucking private jets and shit and like playing to like 17 000 people a night which is i think the most um well i think dead cross ended up playing a couple festivals that were bigger but these were like this like this tour was only festivals you know and then and then like one night they're like we're gonna add a secret you know, a secret show in, in Sydney at this place, it's like 4,000 people. And I'm like a secret show, like secret show is probably going to land like 40 people for, for me. I was like, all right. And then, and they're like, and then I overheard the, you know, the, the promoter, like, okay, you're going to get, um, 40 grand for, for the secret show or 20, it was 20 grand for the secret show. And I'm like, what the fuck? I'm getting paid $1,400 for this whole thing, you know? And like,

And like, you know, and no offense, but those guys are just like using CDJs and pushing play and stop and shit. And I have to go out there and sing. And like they want me to stage dive. And like at one point someone took my fucking shoe off and I'm like, dude, I have no more shoes. Like I only have two. And I'm so I'm like fighting someone in this crowd trying to get my fucking slip on van back. Damn, bro. Shoes work better in Paris. Okay, so you got exploited, not to bring a band back, but you were exploited by the Bloody Beat Roots, and I'm sorry to hear that. Hopefully, you learned some things on that tour. I learned a lot. Like, yeah, it was crazy. I learned that I could chuck wireless microphones into the crowd and bail, and that's so fucking fun because, like, I don't give a shit what happens because it's not my band. That's cool. That's a very cool take. It feels crazy to just be like, and then, like, I'm out. I'm off. I'm fucking going to leave and get some assholes to drive me back to the fucking hotel. I'm done. So, like, 50 Cent, you can whip a cordless mic at someone's head in the crowd and say, all right, I'm going to grab some hummus on the way out, and I'll be in the hotel. Yeah, literally. Okay, well, how – because it seems like around when the locust was, you know, late – 90s early 2000s you know 2001 2 3 or whatever that was when personally i went from like hardcore into electronic music with you know like adults and other electro clash bands that you're obviously familiar with uh i would go to like electro clash nights in long beach at this place the red red room i think and um you know it was just like 40 people doing coke on a monday and listening to electro clash and it was sick but You know, around what time did you start getting more into the EDM zone or the just electronic music zone? It was already kind of like there. I mean, I grew up like obsessing over Six Six Sputnik and Yellow and bands that were like synth heavy adjacent. Like, you know, like not punk like Devo, but like, you know, whatever you I don't know what you want to call Six Six Sputnik.

And that was a huge part of the Locust, but I don't think that we ever were EDM. Obviously, we had real instruments and a drummer and shit. So really what happened was I got a job at this gay club, and that propelled me into hearing the same shit every night and being like, well, this song is decent, or this hook is cool. And so then I started getting into certain kinds of EDM. And then I started a band called All Leather, which was really bad. But we tried to be EDM with instruments. And you can do that if you're rich. And if you're poor, you can't. And we learned that really quick. Yeah, that's tough. It costs a lot of money to play electronic music with a full band. Yeah, because one, we had a guitar electronic drum set, which was the lowest tiered piece of shit. And then we would play like... punk shows that had, like, vocal-only PA, so we're just like, oh, this sucks. Like, no one hears the drums, you know? So there was a lot of problems in that one. Well, you learn the hard way. I like that. You don't seem like a guy who takes the easy road. I mean, yeah, and we learn from our mistakes, and, you know, now I know, hey, if I'm going to do electronic music, like, I'm in this band. planet b and like we know like don't play you know the che cafe or wherever you know like no offense to the che but like play someone's got a killer pa with subs and you'll be fine so yeah i just don't when's the last time you had like a job oh i have one every day uh a job a job where you're not the boss That's a loaded question. Well, so the – so when I was – so the bar that I worked at, the gay bar – and so let me just plug my book, GG Alien and the Mystery Meat, that just came out, which is about that job, which is fucking insane, and there's crazy photos in it, and I'm probably going to get either sued or killed from that book. Okay. Because there's all this Nazis – there's a lot of Nazi shit in it. But anyhow, I worked at this bar until I turned 40, and like right before I turned 40, I was like, man – and not that I'm better than this, but I was like, I cannot –

clean up a 21 year old's vomit anymore like this is just insane i've no one's ever cleaned up my vomit except my mom when i was a child and i'm like i just think like i'm turning fucking 40 no more vomit cleaning up unless it's mine you know or my dog or whatever so like um nice good boundary to set yeah and i and i just like hustled and and i've been hustling for the last nine years so um i'm also a publicist music publicist for myself and but i do it for other artists as well and that is the one thing that kind of pays some of the bills and you know and then i'm like on ebt and shit like that so it all kind of like i live some lifestyle i'm honestly i'm honestly kind of surprised to hear that i didn't i i forget that i just felt like you'd done so much that something would have there'd be some weird source of income from over the years that keeps coming you know what i mean like some like something strange like oh this somebody sampled this and you know i get a check every year for x amount of money i wish i wish there was like a band that would um sample us or me or something, and then I could sue them. That'd be so rad, but that hasn't happened yet. You win the lottery. Are you a litigious person? I don't know. Have you sued people before? Well, I mean, so I did. But, okay, there's two things there. So, yeah, I sued a mechanic who fucked up our van once, and we lost. And then I also sued – That sucks. I sued a mechanic who painted my old car, and that guy fucking bailed. And it was crazy. He, like, wouldn't pay me. And then I got, like, a person – I don't know what they're called – a person to, like, go get my money. And so I hired this guy to, like – not go get it like a thug, but, like, a legal – A mercenary. A mercenary. Like a repo man for your money. No, no, no. No, it's like a legal – I don't know what they're called. A bounty hunter. You got dogged a bounty hunter. I fucking should have done that, but I didn't. I went like the normal human route. You're just like – First mistake. First mistake. Yeah, so anyhow, I was like, hey, he'll go get your money legally. He takes 5%. Cool. And that fucking guy died. And then they're just like – the whole system is like, we don't know how to assess this. And I'm like, god damn it. This fucking guy shit on my car.

not literally but like you know he fucked my car up painting it it's like a paint a paint shop right so like yeah so i sued that guy and then at one point someone had bootlegged the locust record um well okay so someone put out this garbage thing and called it the locust and used our logo and like it wasn't our band it was like a fake thing and it was just total dog shit it wasn't even music well that's like that's a lot of people say that about the regular locust but but but the but this but this was literally not Like it was just someone trying to fuck with us. Okay. So they like press records with a bunch of bullshit noise on it, put your logo on it and sold it under the guise that it was a Locust record. Yeah. And people were like, like buying it for like 50 bucks a seven inch on eBay, you know, and it was kind of crazy. And, but then like the thing that was really, really bad was it got reviewed in Thrasher and Thrasher was like, what the fuck is up with the Locust thing? And they could put out shit like this. This is so offensive. Like fuck that band. And I was like, God damn it. So, so somehow I found out like, i don't know the people who did it and they're from arizona and i fucking think that state sucks partially because of that but i was like man fuck these guys this is like a dickhead move like at least at least like let yourself be known so anyhow i at one point i got one of the people's phone numbers and i was like yo you're not gonna like stop this you know like it's it just sucks that you're making probably more money than the actual band and like your prank is kind of like a dickhead move like it'd be cool to bootleg you know i don't know like Taylor Swift record or whatever. Something that like, it's not like, I'm like, you're kind of fucking with like four normal people, like musician, you know, punk people or whatever, but whatever. So, so I got the guy's number and I was like, okay, so I have an idea. Like you guys want to go on judge Judy and we'll, and we'll, and we'll, and like, we'll sue you, you know? And like, it'll be a, it'll be like a bigger like PR style. And, and so we were trying to like navigate that and it didn't work out. But, and then, and then they just bailed and eventually they quit selling the record, which is.

cool, but I think they probably made a grip off of this really bad record. And now it's probably become a collector's item. Yeah, I just, I mean, I really wish there was some way to say, like, hey, that's not us. Like, I mean, I've said it, but I wish there was, like, a way to, like, like, if you go to, like, probably Discogs, it's probably on there as, like, a regular-ass record of ours, and it's just such a bummer. Yeah, look, I bet you have a pretty valuable record collection, at least, if you needed to unload. I'm sure you got some wild shit. Yeah, you mean, like, my retirement? Yeah, because a friend of mine showed me his Discogs value, and I was like, bro, you have $750,000 worth of records, and it's shit that I'm like, no one knows what this is. This is the most obscure garbage. Yeah. I mean, some of it's not, but a majority of it, as a person who's- I say that about my own records, yeah. But he'll be like, oh, this one, and I'll be like, bro, what is this one? No one knows what this is. What is this? You know what I mean? Oh, all you need is one other person. Well, I mean, I guess you said your retirement fund, are you treating it like an actual investment like that? And because of that, are you thinking that now could be the best time to unload this collection? Or are you going to wait it out? Because, you know, vinyl is, you know, it's peaking right now, but it could also, just like Tesla, take a shit in a year. And then, you know what I mean? So where's your head at with your retirement fund? All right, this episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by Quince. Jason, the temps are warming up. It's getting hot out there. Summer always changes how I get dressed. I need pieces that feel lighter, more breathable, and they're just easy but still put together. I don't want to look like a slob. That's why I keep coming back to Quince. They focus on high-quality essentials that feel and look amazing. Breathable linen and soft organic cottons. Well-made basics but without the luxury markups. That rare balance where everything feels elevated. but still effortless. Yeah, Chris, linen season is here. I wore a linen blazer to dinner a few nights ago in the warm California sun. But, you know, you got that Italy trip coming up this summer and quality European linen pants and shirts.

Upgrade that look starting at just $34. You know, if you get a nice linen suit, a little t-shirt underneath it, some chill shoes, you're looking good, but you're staying cool. The inside of your special areas are nice and dry as you turn up with your besties. So elevate that summer wardrobe. Go to quince.com slash how long for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns, even on a nice holiday now available in Canada. That is Q-U-I-N-C-E dot com slash how long. That'll get you free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince punto com slash how long. Hi Talk House Network listeners, it's your old friend Nels Klein from Wilco here. Wilco is touring this summer and we'd love to see you somewhere on the road. We're playing shows this June and July in Rochester Hills, Michigan, Chautauqua, New York, Lafayette, New York, Bethlehem, Pennsylvania, Vienna, Virginia, Forest Hills, New York, Portland, Maine, Tulsa, Oklahoma, Memphis, Tennessee, LaGrange, Georgia, Charleston. South Carolina, Virginia Beach, Virginia, Wheeling, West Virginia, and Columbus, Ohio. Plus, there are even more dates, some with Willie Nelson that I didn't even mention here. So please go to wilkoworld.net to see the full list of dates. We'll see you on the road this summer. At HSBC UK, when you invest in your business, we're invested too. Whether it's borrowing to buy new equipment, To invest in energy saving or in new technology, we cut through the noise with our sector specialists, regional expertise and tailored finance solutions. So if you're looking to grow your business, we lend more than money. To get insights on how UK businesses are borrowing for growth, search HSBC Business Finance. Lending is subject to status, eligibility criteria and T's and C's apply. All those flexi discs aren't going to put your kids through college if the shit flops. You know what I mean? Well, yeah, I don't have any kids. But, yeah, I don't know what I think. Four-legged friends. My collection is interesting. I don't know. It's like the housing market. Like, should I sell now or should I wait? And maybe they'll gentrify punk even more. And then I should sell. But then I don't know. Yeah, I trip out. Because I'm an archivist. So, like, I have, like.

one of everything i've been on except there's one record that that's missing that i was on but for the most part i have like tons of test pressings and just like kind of gnarly shit that i i could probably like i could probably like unload and then just my regular collection because i'll go to record stores and see stuff on the wall like that thing's 200 bucks i have that you know like i don't know what would you say the what would you say of what is the genre split in the collection we don't need to get into the into the one percent but what would we say like if we had to split into thirds is it genres i've at least heard of i mean most of it's unlistenable you know i mean it's okay that's what i thought that's what i thought that's why i was out that's or or or like i mean i've spent most of my career like trying to like like be genre adjacent but not genre specific like you know like you know good examples like the locust like there was like all this bullshit where like the locust is a grind core it's like yeah we're not like who fucking like we're not saying that like but what is it i i don't know and like and i think that's good um For me, at least, I don't want to be like, that's the thing, you know? Speak for yourself, I do. I want to be the thing. I want to be right down the goddamn middle. Yeah. And in your mind, Justin, you're like, if we're grindcore, then how come every show people call us fags? You know, what is it with that? How do you explain that, guys? That's a good point. I mean, I bet that happens to real grindcore bands, too, though, you know, that are like legit. Who would you say is the realest grindcore band? Like who is the defining grindcore band? Whose core is ground the most? Let's ask someone who's in a grindcore band. I don't know. I'm asking you because you're an underground music expert. That's why I'm asking you. You're very well versed. I'm also not very knowledgeable on the ins and outs of grindcore. Also, I know when you talk about this is the most blah, blah, blah grindcore band, there's going to be like 30 people being like, that guy's a fucking loser. Fuck that guy. He doesn't know shit. I'm like, yeah, you're right. I don't. That's right. It's all opinion. It's all an opinion. I just looked on Reddit.

r slash uh r slash grindcore uh discordance axis oh i love that band they're like the best yeah they are the best holy shit okay yeah okay there we go dave witty that's the one we cleared that up thank you thank you but you know pig destroyer we go we go back you know cattle decapitation who you know as well actually i was speaking of i was listening to a podcast and you were talking about going to a converge show and being surprised at what the crowd looked like versus what you suspected or expected. And Chris and I are a couple of big Converge fans from back in the day, but you said you were going there expecting it to be a little bit of a bro, moshcore, kind of hate-breedy, throw-down, bad vibe kind of situation, but it was actually a very inclusive... Converge is pitchfork music at this point. That's who I imagined being there, like 42-year-old graphic designers with... a mercedes station wagon that's that's literally what i feel i was i was um i mean i love those guys and i like their music a lot so what their audience is like isn't necessarily their fault but i was so impressed and i was like this is fucking cool like they that band navigated into modern times correctly you know and i was like this is this is great but those i feel like they get lumped in i feel like they become kind of like r.i.p but like oz fest acts you know what i mean where it becomes because it's like metal is how people actually classify it so it becomes like the audience changes based on that as you get older and bigger i guess you know more successful yeah i saw this uh last night at the exploited concert there was an obituary poster for a show and it was like there i can't nails was one of the band and bands and there's like another band and i was like they just have like hardcore bands opening for them it's so weird you know um hardcore metal-ish or whatever but like um i don't know like i remember just growing up and like If you didn't have long hair and you were – if you didn't look metal, you were just a fucking whatever, a poser or a pussy or whatever. I remember going to Slayer concerts and getting beat up because I looked like a punk. So I just wonder if it's shifted. You either have to look like a metalhead or a neo-Nazi, and both of those are not the look I want to go for. So I don't know. Yeah, I mean I remember being in high school and then seeing like hardcore bros.

you know show up to school one day with like a cannibal corpse long sleeve with like a you know a baby being ripped apart and blood everywhere and that was when it first started to be like oh we it's a competition to see who's the most fucked up twisted yeah gnarly bro of all time even though i i listened to mineral and grill biscuits every day, I'm going to wear this obituary shirt or cannibal corpse shirt just to get that shock factor. See, that is something I'm so glad. I hate all that shit. I hate it. I'm so glad that when that fork in the road came, I was like... Oh, all right. If we got Texas The Reason and Sunday Real Say over here, I'm going right. You guys can go into this ugly shit. I rode the wave, bro. It's too ugly. Cannibal Corpse is the ugliest shit. I hate the way it looks. Like, I hate the way metal stuff looks. But what about, okay, try this instead. A vulgar display of power shirt. The guy, you know, the punch. Look, there's some classic graphics. I'm speaking, I mean, I think, like, death metal graphics are actually the classic ones. I think the stuff you guys are talking about is some of the ugliest. graphic design ever, ever applied to the genre, like, to music. Well, we want squares like you to think that. Sorry, go ahead. Yeah, exactly. I have to agree, though, because for one, there's, like, the logo you can't read. Two, there's, like, usually it's, like, a giant print with, like, every color you could possibly print on it. And I'm just like, I don't know, just give me a fucking regular t-shirt with one color on it. That shit's classic, you know? I agree. I agree. I just, I think you're right, Jason. There is a shock factor to wearing that stuff. that was very appealing when you're 15. But now, like you were saying, the logo that you can't read, I think we've really jumped the shark with those types, you know, black metal grindcore. Yeah, it's Balenciaga at this point. Where the logo is just so unreal. Like, nobody in the world could ever read it, and the whole point of it is somebody walks past you with that shirt on, and you're like, oh, fuck. That guy listens to... Damn, they're fucking gnarly. I bow down to you, bro. I can't pronounce Norwegian, but this shit is sick. Speaking of Nazi stuff, what do you think about what Kanye West is up to nowadays? For one, he's selling a t-shirt.

Well, he tried to sell the shirt. I was like, that is the lamest marketing bullshit. At least put a logo or a Kanye signature or something. I'm like, you're selling the shirt by all the dudes that beat me up when I was in my teens. That's just some fucking poser shit. But that's also capitalism. It's like, oh, you're just going to take the thing and sell it. Okay, so there's that. But then there's the fact that he's just a fucking dipshit. I don't give a fuck if he's autistic, like, selling shit like that. He's just an asshole, dude. Like, fuck that guy. I was really on the... Before this, I was under... I believe this to be true about a lot of people in his position, that they could fuck up to a point, and if they come back with a hit, everyone forgets it. But he finally... Like Marilyn Manson. Yeah, but he finally crossed the line. Like, he finally is like, all right, bro, we're done. Like... We'll see. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. There's still a chance. If Gold Digger came out today, I don't think people... I think, like... 15 year olds would like it but i don't think he would be embraced in like a big way the way that he would have been otherwise 15 year olds are all you need i mean i was talking about this on the last episode about how uh chris brown you know he a lot of people hated him because he beat up rihanna and you know he was sort of canceled and now young people are so young that they either forgot or never knew that that happened and they just like his music and dancing and they're just like yeah i don't fuck what i guess that happened and it's been long enough in the history books but i don't know yeah and they're just like yeah whatever or i mean i'm sure that'll happen with r kelly and michael jackson and everyone else people's gem i hear michael jackson at restaurants now he's it's all good that's just crazy okay the two things like one is i i feel like there's the there's the like uh domestic violence tip which is just fucking bullshit but then there's like the kanye like i'm gonna flirt with you know neo-nazi bullshit like that's kind of weird because like um i don't know like last night i saw some asshole with the pantera shirt i'm like yo dude the guy did like say white power like he is you know like i don't know if he's like a nazi yeah but then like and then you just see like every asshole driving a tesla now and you're like hey he fucked up and bought the nazi or the swastika or whatever and so i i think that like

people that support it may fuck up but there's also like you can kind of some things you can come back from like again going back to what even exploited he's like i grew up you know in the 70s and 80s and like the swastika wasn't what it represents now you know and he was like i grew up with like sid and suzy like having that shit and and you know and like suzy's jewish and so it's like he was just like it's different but people are still ready to be like yo you know the guy from the explains a nazi and he's like i'm not he's like i fought nazis my whole life so i think there's like A little bit of leeway where you're like, that guy's like on the right path. Or then you're just like, you know, Elon Musk is like clearly not on any right path. He's just a fucking turd, you know, or like. And Kanye can have a comeback when Elon's like, yo, I'm going to just hire that guy and we'll put you on Mars and you can be really popular there and he'll be successful again. That's a good point. If he goes alien mode, he could be accepted. That's a good point. Aliens are going to be like, we don't care that he did that. You guys care about anti-Semites? We don't even know what that means. There is no God. And then aliens are like, it doesn't matter. So did you give your Tesla back? Did you burn it? What did you do with yours? He's Turo-ing it right now while he's figuring it out. You're making some money off it. You're smart. You're making money off of it, I'm sure. I did hear that if you buy those, the truck ones, you weren't allowed to sell it for a certain amount of years. There was a contract. Oh, really? Yeah, I don't know. I would love to – I should probably look into it before I say stupid shit like this, but I was told that if you buy one, you're not allowed to sell it. i don't know why like i believe it elon makes you promise because it'll fuck up the value of it something like that it's like art it's like when art hits auction you know what i mean it's like yeah i would have like thought it would be pretty it is like no one can sell these and like as soon as they all sell he's like all right i'm a fucking nazi good good luck you know like that would have been kind of more amusing to me he's tanking his own market i mean trump is doing that right now with our stock market but yeah that's a whole other pod um i guess speaking of

Of all this stuff going on in the world, we had a friend of ours, this guy Josh Citarella, on our pod a couple months ago, and he interviews a lot of young people who are in emerging dark spaces, eco-terrorism, anarcho-terrorists, and all that stuff. What do you think your relationship with that is? Obviously, growing up in the 90s, there's all that food, not bombs, and burning down the... fur factories and protesting all that stuff and it kind of went down and went away and it seems like you know 14 15 year old kids are are kind of bringing that lifestyle back how do you feel about it um i i grew up with all that i totally support all of that stuff like i think eco-terrorism as they call it uh which i would just call environmentalism or just being smart is fucking rad um but i i you know i worked with i worked with food not bombs or are um you know even like uh or first um i mean i i've associated with some fucking crazy people like this dude that would like go out and sit and blow up whaling ships and i was like that's that's really righteous shit you know like um hold on hold on hold on hold on so when when you meet a guy like that yeah okay this that's a whole there's a that's a whole podcast no but but the whole point there's another book there bro why on earth would he tell you that i thought that's the whole thing He was on the inside. Still. His job was a private investigator. So he was – actually, me and Jose Palafox from my first band, Struggle, met him at our high school because he was investigating a student there. And so we became friends with him because I think he kind of like picked up on our shit because we were working with the Revolutionary Communist Youth Brigade. So he was like, what the fuck are you guys doing? You're doing all this gnarly shit. And so we're like – He could sniff that out. He could sniff that out. Completely. And so motherfucker, Jose invites the guy to our rehearsal. He came to our rehearsal at Dylan, our mom's house in a basement, and he brought this huge file of UFO shit, crazy, crazy shit. He bought an Uzi just to show us because I told Jose, I'm like, this guy's fucking full of shit. And so Jose's like, watch, I'll tell him to bring in shit. And then we start jamming or playing, and the motherfucker puts all these suction cup wire things to this gadget and lays on the floor.

it's like doing something i don't know and we're just like what the fuck so we kind of were just like into this dude being like a weirdo and then he was like he was older than us and he had money so he a couple times he's like yeah i'll drive you guys up to santa barbara for your show and like we're like okay cool so we're cruising up to santa barbara and he's got this sick bmw and we're all like four you know and 15 and so we're cruising up to santa barbara and we get pulled over and uh we're like oh shit we're getting pulled over because you're going 95 like that's kind of crazy and keep in mind he's like i don't know what his age was an adult he's a definitely an adult man and he's got like three or four fucking underage you know dudes in the car like from the band and so he pulls us over he's like uh we might have a problem we're like what do you mean he's like i got a bazooka in the in the or a missile launcher in the in the trunk and we're like what so so we're like we're all sitting in the car being like i thought that was my base cabinet what do you mean it's a it's a bazooka yeah so he gets out of the car and we're just we're all he gets out of the car to like go talk to the cop we're like dude he's gonna shoot you like that you don't go talk to the cop so he like he's back there for like quite a while and then he comes back he's like all good and then starts driving we're all just like we're all like white you know just like fucking ghostly like oh my god So we're in the, and then finally we're like, dude, what the fuck? And he's like, it's cool. Like, I think, you know, I, we worked it out or whatever. And so when we got to the venue in Santa Barbara, I was like, I got to see this thing. I feel like you're lying. He's like, don't open that Rickenbacker case, guys. He opened the trunk and there was a fucking missile launcher in there. And I was like, holy shit. And like, that's that, you know? So, but he also like, he had like this, at one point he showed us this thing he had. It was like this, it looked like a, like a really small satellite dish and you like hold it.

And he would go up on this mountain that was, like – we went to high school in this area called Pacific Beach, and there was this, like, mountain. So he'd go up on this mountain, and you could point it into people's houses and, like, hear everything. It was so crazy. So, like, he wasn't fucking around. But anyhow, at one point he was like, yeah, I got to go away for a while. I'm going to go blow up these ships. We're fucking – he was, like, outsourced or something, like – He was outsourced from Greenpeace, actually. I guess this is what his story was. Greenpeace couldn't be like, we're going to go blow up the ship. They're like, we're going to pay this guy, and he's going to go blow up his fucking whaling ship. Sure, they have to hire a contractor. I love that. I wonder if I knew. Jason, do you know any freelancers that would blow up a whaling ship? I don't really know. Can you send me a W9? They're all tattoo artists now. They're out of the game. There's a freelancer for everything. No, there is a freelancer for everything. That's a great story. I mean, I feel like you've – did you guys – Touring when you're that age is pretty weird. I feel like there's really too much to be seen out there. You may have been a little too young. Back in those days, you've been all over the world, played in the best and worst venues and cities. For your style of music, what you're doing, what's the worst city to play in? Let's say U.S. because Eastern Europe is probably big for you guys. There's always worse cities everywhere. It depends on how negative the audience will be towards you. Those would be my ancestors. It's either like getting... violently uh beaten up or or like robbed you know and so that would be phoenix or or st louis um those are the are you from are you from phoenix yeah fuck that's that whole that whole city's a hold on you're saying to me that all the places in the world they're the worst phoenix and st louis those are where my worst experiences have happened yeah it's funny because we asked that question a lot to bands on the show and they're either like oh i don't want to say because i don't want to offend any towns that i'm going to be in i'll offend them i don't give a fuck but you're like well

On the metric of these are the towns that I get beat up and robbed in the most, I'll have to say Phoenix. Yeah. You can kind of say whatever you want when those are the reasons, I think. Yeah. There was this weird stint that the locusts had, which was like – Phoenix is an awful place, I will say. Yeah. So the Carolinas into like Florida, Atlanta-ish, all that whole like area, we had a weird problem where there was like this straight edge gang following a locust and like fucking our shit up. Hold on. I might have been in that gang. What was it called? Do you know? I don't remember what that one was called. I got to be careful. I got to be careful. Well, there was the Monster Crew. There was that one, but I think that was a different one. Those guys I tried to blow up with dynamite, but I didn't really want to blow them up with dynamite. I just wanted to threaten them with dynamite. I wonder which guys, because that's who I went to high school with. So Chris and I are from competing straight-edge gangs. Yeah, I'm from Atlanta. He's from Atlanta. I'm from Huntington Beach. You guys played a lot of shows in Atlanta, though. I feel like I saw The Locust a lot in Atlanta. Yeah. Atlanta was fucked up one time under the couch. That's the best, yeah, the classic. It was on the Georgia Tech campus. Yep. Someone smashed an entire watermelon on my head, and I was like, dude, it hurt so bad. It was like, those things, you know, it had some fucking, it was like. That wasn't me. I didn't go Gallagher mode that night. That was not me. I've broken a windshield with a watermelon. They can do some damage. They could have broke my skull. It fucking hurt so bad. And I was like, and then they like. scattered like everyone's like laughing i'm like dude just like if i'm gonna be a fuckhead to you like i'm gonna be like hey that was me like let's do this you know and i was like you're just a chicken shit right um that's my biggest problem is people being fucking chicken shits at least like own up to it and if you're a badass and you could fucking kick my ass just be like yo i threw the watermelon and bashed it on your head you know like have you just based on what have you won fights before one is an interesting way uh of uh

I'm putting it. You mean not died? Not died. I mean, I'm saying – because it sounds like you've been assaulted several times based on just kind of who you are. But you also strike me as a kind of slippery little guy who could kind of hold his own. Scrappy. I can, but the thing that is like a blessing and a curse is my wit. So usually I'll get my ass handed to me, and I'm still like, yo, oh, you're a Nazi, and your name is – Joe, but I know you're really Jose. And I'm like, you can keep kicking my ass, but jokes on you fucking dipshit, you know? And so then at the end of the day, like, yeah, I won, even though I'm bleeding in my, you know, I'm fucking got a broken rib or whatever, you know? Sure. So when's the last time you got in a fight? When's the last time you had a full on? Cause you're, how old are you? 45, 40, 49. Okay. You look great, by the way, I want to say. You look amazing. You really do. I'm sure you've got some bad tattoos. We all do. But otherwise, you look amazing. Unless there's a blur on Zoom right now, you look 32 straight away. Yeah, you look amazing. No hyperbole. You drink and stuff too, right? No, I mean, I don't drink, but I don't really drink, yeah. I've been pretty good about avoiding like... hey, I'm going to fuck my body up. Do you exercise? Do you have a skincare routine or is this just God? I do yoga seven days a week, so there's that. Okay, namaste, bitch. You got the balance. Okay, I got you. I got you. Yeah, whatever. Okay, you do yoga seven days a week, but you don't feel too great about the world of Krishna, do you? I fucking hate that shit, man. Like, yeah. Yeah. I have a, like, you know, we grew up with, like, it's like shelter. Like, oh, my God, Ray, what are you doing, dude? You're fucking up, man. Look, we've all made mistakes. We had Ray on this pod about a year ago. That was funny. So when you say shelter is fucking up, do you mean, like, the music is bad? Yeah, I do. Shelter, you know, I will say, I know it's cribbed from their, you know, sort of.

pseudo-religious practices, but great iconography, like we were talking about earlier. The records looked really cool. You know, 108 and Shelter, nothing looked like that. You know what I mean? So it was like it looked crazy, but the music did suck. I don't remember if it sucked, but I just remember being like, God, this is fucking bad, man. You guys think cows are cooler than women? That's fucking weird, man. Like, I don't know. Like, it doesn't seem very punk to be like, we're going to rank, you know, living beings by like men, cows, women. That is confusing. You make a good point. In the same way that you'll see a documentary about like the guy who started Bikram yoga. That guy's a fucking turd. Yeah, yeah. I mean, there's predators everywhere. But then you're like, well, do you like punk? You know, do you like fucking the first screwdriver record or whatever? You know, it's like, oh, man. Like, yeah, there's going to be a shithead in everything. Of course. Of course. Yeah. And I think like. people have co-opted yoga and I, and I know to like go to instructors that are like, like my two favorite instructors, one's like heavily into martial arts stuff and the other one's a mortician. And I'm like, those two fucking people rule. They have like a really strange take on, on. the practice and i get a lot out of it i was gonna take you for i thought you might be a weird distance runner is where i was gonna go i thought you might have been like a marathon guy low-key what one of my bandmates in planet b is and it's funny because he he got uh he he's crazy because he's like he like drinks every day uh and he does cocaine all the time and then he like will go running broken like 15 miles a day and i'm like how the hell like it's so crazy how that guy works that's called that's what we call an operator how old is this person i think he's like 47 or 48 yeah he's like that's crazy what does he do for a living um he runs a recording studio and oh well that's fine then that's what he's supposed to be doing he also does flooring yeah but he'll be like he'll be like hey like when the pandemic happened he's like okay like i got something to tell you and i was like oh shit like what happened he's like i have

I have COVID, and you were at the studio yesterday, and I just want to let you know that I tested positive for COVID. But he's like, but I feel fucking great. I just ran 13 miles and fucking did all this blowing shit. I was like, wait a minute. What the fuck? The real medicine. The real medicine. The real ivermectin. He didn't ever feel it, and I didn't get it. So I was like, oh, that's crazy shit. So what did you do during COVID? Did you make a bunch of music? I did, yeah. Him and I made a bunch. I went up to L.A., and we made Deaf Club Records, too, or something. Yeah, I just humbled. household uh we worked on the satanic planet record we were that was crazy too it's like we're in like a pandemic and we're like working on this satanic planet thing which is this weird project that i have and then we're like hey let's get let's see if dave lombardo would play on one of the songs and then dave's like i don't have anything else to do i'll just join the band we're like oh that's that's cool okay let's just get that guy in the fucking satanic band so how many bands are we in currently two and a half Two and a half. Half meaning one is not active but not deceased. Is that where the half comes from? No, it's like my normal real bands are Def Club and Planet B. And then for me, the half is Satanic Planet, which is basically Planet B plus Lucian Greaves. But that band doesn't really play because of a lot of reasons. Everyone's spread out and because like. People, like, legitimately want to kill Lucian. And, like, it's like, do we need to wear a bulletproof vest when we play and shit? Like, it's pretty gnarly. Because they try to blow him up and stuff. Like, yeah. The amount of explosions and explosive devices in your life is alarming, I would say. Yeah, it has a real Beavis energy to it. Yeah, it does. Yes, it does. Have you noticed that, like, it's been long enough to wear... kids are like really into the locust now and you're getting offers to to do reunion yeah you're not doing yeah you're not cashing out like the rest of these like if orchid and satia can sell it out i'm sure you can this is a crazy topic okay so one gabe serbian our drummer passed away so we're we're not okay we're not gonna do that um ever um so so that that but we were active up until like right after the pandemic but like when he passed away like we actually had stuff booked uh uh like on the books to to do um so so like

um the cashing out thing's weird because i like for one i'm like uh you know no offense to anybody but i'm like how did that happen like you know because i'll just say like no no no justin it's shocking it's shocking i i wrote about this last but i saw like people i'd never i just it's crazy like like people wearing a satia hoodie on like the f train going to whole foods in 2025 is crazy uh i mean those guys are cool that you know they played with the locusts and stuff and and um i just can't i'm like i don't i don't understand like okay so for instance like i have a problem okay i'll just be like totally transparent here swing kids are playing a show at the end of this month and it's really strange to me for two reasons one um our guitar player passed away and we did play after he passed away as part of this like release of this book this like reunion thing with unbroken who he was our guitar player eric was in both bands so it made it made sense and like that music because of eric and the and the members in the band means like it holds a place in my heart and like the band you know right before we like officially broke up back when we were a real band we got a second guitar player so when we play it's not like totally bizarre ish because it's like real members yeah sure sure yeah I also am completely aware that where I will criticize that band, I will say that the weak link in that band is me. And I did not know how to sing. I did not know how to write lyrics. And I don't think what I contribute to that band is good. I think that Eric's songwriting, his guitar playing is fucking sick. But I also know that he completely was ripping off John Rhys. So there's a lot of layers to that. Yeah. Our bass player, John, was like, hey, you guys want to play this show? It's for my 50th birthday. I'm doing this festival thing. I'm like... In my mind, I'm like, Jose's not going to do it, so I'm going to say yeah, so I'm not the bad guy. And I'm like, yeah, I'll totally fucking do that. That'll be cool. And then Jose said yes, and I'm like, motherfucker, now I have to play this show. Who else is playing this show? Oh, it's not even a big deal. It's like modern, normal punk bands in San Diego and Tijuana. Swing Kids and then a bunch of smaller bands. But Swing Kids might even be a bigger – I feel like that could even be a – in my mind, that might be a bigger check than the Locust, depending on who you're talking to.

people that are like i'm flying in i'm like you're fucking gonna be bummed you know but everyone like i mean the show hasn't even sold out it's at the casbah 230 capacity like hasn't sold out no one gives a fuck we're not satia or orchid so are you looking forward to playing no sounds like medium i i we rehearsed a couple weekends ago for two days and the first day i was like this is fucking terrible we should back out right now and then the second day i was like this is pretty cool like You guys are funny, and I love you, and this is cool to, like, be with you guys. How many Swing Kid songs exist? 11. Okay. That's what I was – okay, so you're going to play 10 or all 11? Just all 11. I think there's – maybe there's 12. There's one song we're not going to play because, like, unless we have to play, like – unless they're, like, you guys have to play – you're doing this festival. We're paying you a normal amount of money for your reunion bullshit. I don't know what reunion bands get. 50 grand maybe? I don't know. 200,000? Did you make merch? uh we have i have lps i mean i run the no you need to make you know you need to make t-shirts right now do not fuck this up bro i'm telling you well i know i know what you mean because like the the something about the doing the reunion thing it to me it always felt a little it felt kind of sad or like it's for the people who are still stuck in the in the past and then when you see the you like the young kids who are into it come to the show, it's not going to be the same that it was back in the day. It's not. It feels like a shell of itself, and you kind of feel like you're... like a prostitute on display cashing in for this check sex worker and i used to think that i used to think that i used to think that but now i think you're a great example of someone who never made money the first time so you should be able to make money the second time i feel that feels fair to me thank you i i i look forward to that that paycheck well i guess to that point chris chris will be your new manager moving forward of course but yeah you want to make some money baby let's talk do you think that

You mentioned the word a couple times on this show and in another interview that I heard you on. Do you feel like your need to be righteous or the one person who's still righteous and holding on to the true punk ethos? Do you think you're potentially too righteous to get a check in 2025? I do. I do. I appreciate that question. um punk is is is is great you know like it helped me survive in life but i think punk also has this like weird bullshit stigma of like these morals that that like don't let you um negotiate reality you know and so like uh a lot of it has to do with like i mean i love fugazi but like how like they set things up and then like here comes like ebullition which is what i grew up with and like you know ebullition was really weird because i had kent mcclard just shitting all over swing kids because we weren't like struggle we were like we had better haircuts and we weren't like talking about how we actually wanted to fucking kill cops we were just like metaphorically saying how we don't like cops or whatever so so like and then you have like kent mcclard shitting all over us and then and then all of a sudden i've heard the name kent mcclard in so long well now he's probably cashing in on orchid and he's like selling yes 20,000 copies of that record, which no offense to Orkin, I've never heard it because it kind of came after, you know, Swing Kids and Crimson Curse. Yeah, you did it first, so you didn't need to hear it. But that's like the Refuse thing. Oh, yeah, or like the Refuse thing. When you mentioned Fugazi, are you talking to, did you bring up Fugazi in the way that like every album has to cost $5, every show has to be no more than $5, we set these boundaries? And then you're like, cool, adjust for inflation. And we all lose money doing this thing that we love. So I spend hours a day. I think that they are like sort of the like the pope of, you know, of like modern or like not a moral hardcore, you know, and like and I and I say it in a good way because I really respect what they did. I think they I think they like there was that offer like this probably not that much money now, but they were offered like.

a million dollars to play coachella or something like that you know and like ian was like We're not fucking playing again until we play. And next time we play, it'll be for free in D.C. And I was like, that is so badass to say that. Well, as long as he doesn't play for Bernie Sanders, that's cool. I'm fine with that. As long as Fugazi doesn't play for Bernie Sanders rally. That's where I draw the line. I wonder, like. They've been asked, I'm sure. To play for Bernie Sanders. That would be sick. I'll go to that. I could really see somebody thinking that's a good idea. But also, they're in that position to turn a million dollars down. To say no. I'm not. You're not. Yeah, yeah. A lot of people who are real true punks are like, I put in the work for decades and I'm never going to get that offer. But the people whose bills are paid, who are getting a lot of money coming in every month from selling cool T-shirts and vinyl records, they're like, a million. I could take it. It'd be cool, but I also don't need it. Yeah. Well, I've never had the carrot dangle. So the Swing Kid show that's coming up is an interesting point because it's like, we're playing the show it's not sold out there's a it's a fucking festival it's like there's just all a festival as in like there's like eight bands you're like okay we're i'm gonna maybe walk out of here with 40 bucks you know and that's fine um i i i want to spend time with my friends and celebrate my friend's birthday like he's making it to 50 like that's really honorable because He probably shouldn't have, you know, and none of us, none of us should have, you know? So like, that's cool. I'll do that. And I'll, and that's fine. But like, I, no one said like, Hey, you want to do the swing kids reunion circuit and play all the things and get paid, you know, a half a million dollars. Like that's not, no one's done it. And if they, if they dangled it, I'm going to totally be a dick here. But like, I feel like there's so many angles to it. Like I want it to be like the gnarliest shit. Like if we're going to come back. We've been rehearsing and I'm like, yo, we have to be fucking better than we were then because I've seen bands get back together and I'm like, this sucks. Or to know, don't fuck around and try to write another record. Definitely don't do that. Look, how many fat guys are in the band?

no no one then you're good that's what i'm trying to say that's great because that that's what i'm trying to say you're fine because sometimes you go see these bands i mean i'm not going to name names but i went and saw a band recently where the guy needed a respirator and a wheelchair yeah and it's just like this ain't doing it bro this is not making me this didn't make me feel good i think there's a way to do it like like my friend nick plays for iggy pop now and it's and i think he i think iggy pop is like a this sort of like dinosaur of a you know like of a of a musician and but like watching him perform and do those songs is cool because he's got a fucking stellar band surrounding him and i think that's a cool move too like i just feel like yeah i see what you're saying so like with swing kids i'm like we recruited a second guitar player like like we should have it needs to sound better it needs to be fucking sick you know and i agree with you no that's a good attitude to have i feel like maybe some of those people did just like they're just like phoning it in which is fine um I mean, you should sound better than you were when you were fucking 17. You've been playing music a lot since then, so you should be better, right? In theory, yeah. And I feel like I'm a better vocalist, but as we're rehearsing the songs, I'm like, why did I fucking write this shit? The syllables don't fit. This is really weird. It's reminding you of your flaws at a younger age. And you can't really change it at this point. You gotta just... Yep. Now, if I'm flying in to see you guys, I better hear the words I know. You know what I mean? That's the guy, Andrew. Okay, so everyone in San Diego, go see Swing Kids at the Classic Che Cafe. No, no, Casbah. At the Classic Casbah Theater. Get a bomb-ass California burrito afterwards. I'd love a bomb-ass burrito right now. And you have a book. Your book is out now, or it's coming out soon? Yeah, it's out. Yeah. Okay, book is out. Where do I go? 31g.com? Where do I get the book? Okay. T-H-R-E-E-O-N-E-G.

dot com uh yeah gg alien and the mystery meat it's probably i thought it'd get me canceled but it hasn't yet so okay well we'll be the judge of that uh no that changes that changes today justin we'll we'll signal boost it to our audience welcome to hell bro we'll cancel you you don't have any baristas in brooklyn listen to this podcast they're looking we'll see you on reddit we'll see you on reddit we'll see you later thanks justin appreciate your time justin thank you thank you so much